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GSP no match for charging gorilla

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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby JACKnoneREACHER » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:36 pm

I'd still put $20 on George, with a solid gameplan from firhas and full release of da riddum he'd get it done
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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby slevin » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:57 pm

PainDog wrote:Thank you, gentlemen, for the feedback.

I had not really been thinking about a fight between a bear and a gorilla tough I am sure it is something I have thought about before. I very interested in the biological sciences, and powerful animals have always been particularly intriguing whether they are living animals like a gorilla or a bear or an extinct one like a dinosaur or an Andrewsarchus.

There is a website where people debate animal battles, every sort of match up you could think of, from dinosaurs vs. modern animals to battles between different extinct animals from different time periods like the Smilodon vs. Deinonychus thread below.

http://carnivoraforum.com/topic/10331664/1/

After writing my post yesterday I decided to check out the carnivora forum to see if the black bear vs. gorilla match up had been discussed…and it had with the majority of the votes going towards the black bear.

However, one of the posters kind of swayed some of the others by claiming that the bite force of the gorilla was exaggerated and should be lower than the black bear…maybe even half of the bears bite force.

Now this is not at all what is in line with what has been published on science websites, where the gorilla is usually ranked among the top animals in terms of bite force, and it doesn’t really mesh with common sense in my opinion.

The website below lists the gorilla’s bite force at around 1300psi, which is quite in line with most estimates I have seen.
https://listverse.com/2012/11/05/top-10 ... stroy-you/

As I mentioned in the first post gorillas have enormous jaw muscles. Now with that said not everything that goes into bite force can be explained by looking at one or two muscles, the biomechanics can be quite complicated.

I am not aware of any brutal attacks carried out by gorillas on people, however there have been several by chimpanzees. Chimpanzees which are around ¼ the size of a gorilla have easily bit through the human skulls, bit through the carpal bones in human hands, and have demonstrated the strength to smash through car windshields.

The jaw muscles of a gorilla are not 4x the volume of the jaw muscles of a chimp, rather they would be in excess of ten times the volume of a chimps.

Image
note the size difference in the sagittal crest of the gorilla and chimpanzee

Additionally, gorillas routinely bite through very fibrous plant material. Something that is often ignored is the bite for of herbivores which are likely more powerful than most carnivores. When vegans say humans don’t have the sharp teeth or jaws to eat unprocessed meat…we also don’t have the jaws or teeth to eat unprocessed vegetable matter (note that even the fruit we eat have been selectively bred for thousands of years to make them as human friendly as they are). I would say with confidence that the higher end bite force estimates of the gorilla are going to be more accurate than the lower estimates.

When we consider this fight we also should consider fight IQ. Neither animal is going to do very well in this category.

All of these great imaginary battles between two extraordinarily powerful animals like a triceratops and a T. rex are unlikely to have happened, and match-ups between existing animals even if they live in the same geographical area are unlikely to happen.

Nature plays for keeps and even minor injuries could prove fatal in the wild. A broken bone could mean a debilitating injury that would prevent the animal from hunting and ultimately starving to death, a laceration could lead to infection and ultimately death. Animals generally play it safe and predators tend to go for the weak, old, and sick.

Also, black bears are not the apex predators in their habitat, since their range historically overlapped with grizzly bears. Grizzly bears have even been known to eat black bears.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-ne ... y-1354935/

What that means is black bears would be much less likely to confront a challenge than an animal that is an apex predator like a grizzly bear or even a tiger. When you aren’t at the top of the food chain fleeing is always going to be an option.

Gorillas would also be more show than bite. There would be a lot of posturing, tearing down small tress and chest beating, but likely very little actual attacking.

So if they did meet in the wild both would likely make a lot of noise but then go their separate ways.

We would have to somehow train them to fight to see how well they would really match up with each other, which should make the fight more about the physical attributes each animal brings to the table.

When considering the physical attributes, like I said in the first post I would have to give it to the gorilla. If the gorilla was able to appropriately use in physical abilities could get behind the bear, use its long arms and fingers to actually be able to grip and hold on to the bear, and then use its powerful jaws to inflict damage.

Bears usually use their arms to set up their jaws when fighting. Again, if the gorilla understood how to use its physical attributes, it would have a greater range of flexibility in its shoulders than the bear.


grizzlies fighting, the grizzly is the size of a gorilla and a black bear combined

I don’t think an actual gorilla fight has been caught on camera…just some brief halfhearted conflicts in zoos.


If the gorilla didn’t use its attributes well and just charged into the bear, I could see the bear winning. The bear would have the height advantage and has the longer jaws so would be easier to deliver bites. Then again to get to the vital areas of the gorilla could be difficult since its head, neck, and shoulders are so heavily muscled.

Either way it’s something that isn’t going to happen, but is interesting to think about.

When you said Black Bear I thought of this clip.


Here is the rest of the clip.

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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby YMCA » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:37 pm

DeceptaCon wrote:He finally met an opponent he couldn't hump.


Yeah, like how he humped that hook into Bisping's head and then choked him to sleep.

Or headkicking Hughes, or armbarring him, or making BJ's corner throw in the towel, or Serra cowering from knees, or ruining Jon Fitch or Alves or Hardy.

Yeah, sure. :roll:
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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby DeceptaCon » Fri Jun 22, 2018 4:58 pm

YMCA wrote:
DeceptaCon wrote:He finally met an opponent he couldn't hump.


Yeah, like how he humped that hook into Bisping's head and then choked him to sleep.

Or headkicking Hughes, or armbarring him, or making BJ's corner throw in the towel, or Serra cowering from knees, or ruining Jon Fitch or Alves or Hardy.

Yeah, sure. :roll:

Yeah but Bisping was a one-eyed gorilla.
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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby hawdrigoh » Fri Jun 22, 2018 7:09 pm

One thing’s for certain, bears and gorillas don’t cut weight, grease up, duck Anderson Silva for a decade, hightail it when USADA testing is implemented, cherry-pick one-eyed 40 year olds, and use not being able to shit properly as an excuse to not defend a belt.

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They also don’t tap to strikes to a LW.


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They also don’t believe they’ve been abducted by aliens.


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They also don’t only care about their meaningless legacy.


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They fight because they just like to fucking fight.


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Some men were born to fight gorillas and bears. Some weren't.
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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby hawdrigoh » Fri Jun 22, 2018 7:16 pm

Oldtoby420 wrote:Grizzly / Kodiak / Polar Bear > Silverback Gorilla

Would take that bet all day with top tier of each animal going at it. One is one of the largest apex predators on earth that hunts & kills it's prey with multiple killing tools & no natural predators the other is well tbh don't need to go on to bother explaining to know which of the two would win. Ones a predator & well ones just not.

Also there's bigger Hybrid Grizzly / Polar Bears out there then any of those species that would make a Silver Back Gorrilla it's bitch.


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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby philphan » Fri Jun 22, 2018 7:22 pm

hawdrigoh wrote:
Oldtoby420 wrote:Grizzly / Kodiak / Polar Bear > Silverback Gorilla

Would take that bet all day with top tier of each animal going at it. One is one of the largest apex predators on earth that hunts & kills it's prey with multiple killing tools & no natural predators the other is well tbh don't need to go on to bother explaining to know which of the two would win. Ones a predator & well ones just not.

Also there's bigger Hybrid Grizzly / Polar Bears out there then any of those species that would make a Silver Back Gorrilla it's bitch.


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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby DeceptaCon » Fri Jun 22, 2018 8:24 pm

philphan wrote:
hawdrigoh wrote:
Oldtoby420 wrote:Grizzly / Kodiak / Polar Bear > Silverback Gorilla

Would take that bet all day with top tier of each animal going at it. One is one of the largest apex predators on earth that hunts & kills it's prey with multiple killing tools & no natural predators the other is well tbh don't need to go on to bother explaining to know which of the two would win. Ones a predator & well ones just not.

Also there's bigger Hybrid Grizzly / Polar Bears out there then any of those species that would make a Silver Back Gorrilla it's bitch.


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:lol:
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:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby OuchThatDidntHurt » Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:35 pm

DeceptaCon wrote:
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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I came in to say that if the gorilla in question is tattooed on someone's chest, then my money is on GSP.

You beat me to the Conor reference.


As far at the other side of this conversation... Has anyone brought up Bear (Grizzly or Polar) vs. Tiger ? (or the tiger/lion mix that is giant, I forget if it's male tiger/female lion or male lion/female tiger but one of those mixes makes for a big kitty cat).
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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby PainDog » Sat Jun 23, 2018 1:31 am

OuchThatDidntHurt wrote:
DeceptaCon wrote:
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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I came in to say that if the gorilla in question is tattooed on someone's chest, then my money is on GSP.

You beat me to the Conor reference.


As far at the other side of this conversation... Has anyone brought up Bear (Grizzly or Polar) vs. Tiger ? (or the tiger/lion mix that is giant, I forget if it's male tiger/female lion or male lion/female tiger but one of those mixes makes for a big kitty cat).


Liger's (male lion female tiger mix that is gigantic) are too big without any cardio. They would likely not even match up well against a tiger despite having a large size advantage.


Tiger vs. brown bear....is a strange match up.

Cats are natures ultimate predators; they are explosive, fast, with sharp teeth, sharp claws, great rotation in their front paws, can fight off of their backs, and aren't afraid to try some high risk moves jumping from height.

A large bear though is going to still have a tremendous size advantage. If you go by average size of larger members of the species the bear (if we are talking kodiak brown bears or polar bears) is going to be at least double the tigers size.

The Siberian brown bear is smaller, usually weighing less than 600 pounds, and is a prey species for the siberian tiger.

If the environment allows for the tiger to ambush the bear...then I would go with the tiger....up to a point where the size difference is just too massive.

Even with the ambush I cant see the tiger killing a bear that is 3 times its size.
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Re: GSP no match for charging gorilla

Postby OuchThatDidntHurt » Mon Jun 25, 2018 7:42 pm

PainDog wrote:
OuchThatDidntHurt wrote:
DeceptaCon wrote:
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Spoiler:
Image


I came in to say that if the gorilla in question is tattooed on someone's chest, then my money is on GSP.

You beat me to the Conor reference.


As far at the other side of this conversation... Has anyone brought up Bear (Grizzly or Polar) vs. Tiger ? (or the tiger/lion mix that is giant, I forget if it's male tiger/female lion or male lion/female tiger but one of those mixes makes for a big kitty cat).


Liger's (male lion female tiger mix that is gigantic) are too big without any cardio. They would likely not even match up well against a tiger despite having a large size advantage.


Tiger vs. brown bear....is a strange match up.

Cats are natures ultimate predators; they are explosive, fast, with sharp teeth, sharp claws, great rotation in their front paws, can fight off of their backs, and aren't afraid to try some high risk moves jumping from height.

A large bear though is going to still have a tremendous size advantage. If you go by average size of larger members of the species the bear (if we are talking kodiak brown bears or polar bears) is going to be at least double the tigers size.

The Siberian brown bear is smaller, usually weighing less than 600 pounds, and is a prey species for the siberian tiger.

If the environment allows for the tiger to ambush the bear...then I would go with the tiger....up to a point where the size difference is just too massive.

Even with the ambush I cant see the tiger killing a bear that is 3 times its size.



You've put a lot of thought into this.

Linker should plan a field trip to the zoo, or some kind of BBC Earth trip.
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