Official Religion Thread

[philphan]

Alcohol easily.

Winner!

[MiniMan]

Alcohol easily.

Winner!

A couple of quick searches says tobacco kills 4-5 times more than alcohol.

Then alcohol almost certainly.

[Burritoking1000]

Alcohol easily.

Winner!

A couple of quick searches says tobacco kills 4-5 times more than alcohol.

Then alcohol almost certainly.

Tobacco easily. Love all the anti-marijuana jibberish in this thread, I don't even smoke weed and you motherfuckers sound silly.

[philphan]

haha Cigs are the worst overall for sure, but for the family its booze.

[Burritoking1000]

It's a shame some people have such addictive tendencies... I smoke the odd cigarette once in a blue moon and only if I'm drinking. Never got why anyone would want to smoke an entire pack a day, that's just disgusting.

[TRL]

please read all of this before you comment:

What If Jesus Meant All That Stuff?

This radical Christian's ministry for the poor, The Simple Way, has gotten him in some trouble with his fellow Evangelicals. We asked him to address those who don't believe.

BY SHANE CLAIBORNE

The Simple Way
To all my nonbelieving, sort-of-believing, and used-to-be-believing friends: I feel like I should begin with a confession. I am sorry that so often the biggest obstacle to God has been Christians. Christians who have had so much to say with our mouths and so little to show with our lives. I am sorry that so often we have forgotten the Christ of our Christianity.

Forgive us. Forgive us for the embarrassing things we have done in the name of God.

The other night I headed into downtown Philly for a stroll with some friends from out of town. We walked down to Penn's Landing along the river, where there are street performers, artists, musicians. We passed a great magician who did some pretty sweet tricks like pour change out of his iPhone, and then there was a preacher. He wasn't quite as captivating as the magician. He stood on a box, yelling into a microphone, and beside him was a coffin with a fake dead body inside. He talked about how we are all going to die and go to hell if we don't know Jesus.

Some folks snickered. Some told him to shut the hell up. A couple of teenagers tried to steal the dead body in the coffin. All I could do was think to myself, I want to jump up on a box beside him and yell at the top of my lungs, "God is not a monster." Maybe next time I will.

The more I have read the Bible and studied the life of Jesus, the more I have become convinced that Christianity spreads best not through force but through fascination. But over the past few decades our Christianity, at least here in the United States, has become less and less fascinating. We have given the atheists less and less to disbelieve. And the sort of Christianity many of us have seen on TV and heard on the radio looks less and less like Jesus.

At one point Gandhi was asked if he was a Christian, and he said, essentially, "I sure love Jesus, but the Christians seem so unlike their Christ." A recent study showed that the top three perceptions of Christians in the U. S. among young non-Christians are that Christians are 1) antigay, 2) judgmental, and 3) hypocritical. So what we have here is a bit of an image crisis, and much of that reputation is well deserved. That's the ugly stuff. And that's why I begin by saying that I'm sorry.

Now for the good news.

I want to invite you to consider that maybe the televangelists and street preachers are wrong — and that God really is love. Maybe the fruits of the Spirit really are beautiful things like peace, patience, kindness, joy, love, goodness, and not the ugly things that have come to characterize religion, or politics, for that matter. (If there is anything I have learned from liberals and conservatives, it's that you can have great answers and still be mean... and that just as important as being right is being nice.)

The Bible that I read says that God did not send Jesus to condemn the world but to save it... it was because "God so loved the world." That is the God I know, and I long for others to know. I did not choose to devote my life to Jesus because I was scared to death of hell or because I wanted crowns in heaven... but because he is good. For those of you who are on a sincere spiritual journey, I hope that you do not reject Christ because of Christians. We have always been a messed-up bunch, and somehow God has survived the embarrassing things we do in His name. At the core of our "Gospel" is the message that Jesus came "not [for] the healthy... but the sick." And if you choose Jesus, may it not be simply because of a fear of hell or hope for mansions in heaven.

Don't get me wrong, I still believe in the afterlife, but too often all the church has done is promise the world that there is life after death and use it as a ticket to ignore the hells around us. I am convinced that the Christian Gospel has as much to do with this life as the next, and that the message of that Gospel is not just about going up when we die but about bringing God's Kingdom down. It was Jesus who taught us to pray that God's will be done "on earth as it is in heaven." On earth.

One of Jesus' most scandalous stories is the story of the Good Samaritan. As sentimental as we may have made it, the original story was about a man who gets beat up and left on the side of the road. A priest passes by. A Levite, the quintessential religious guy, also passes by on the other side (perhaps late for a meeting at church). And then comes the Samaritan... you can almost imagine a snicker in the Jewish crowd. Jews did not talk to Samaritans, or even walk through Samaria. But the Samaritan stops and takes care of the guy in the ditch and is lifted up as the hero of the story. I'm sure some of the listeners were ticked. According to the religious elite, Samaritans did not keep the right rules, and they did not have sound doctrine... but Jesus shows that true faith has to work itself out in a way that is Good News to the most bruised and broken person lying in the ditch.

It is so simple, but the pious forget this lesson constantly. God may indeed be evident in a priest, but God is just as likely to be at work through a Samaritan or a prostitute. In fact the Scripture is brimful of God using folks like a lying prostitute named Rahab, an adulterous king named David... at one point God even speaks to a guy named Balaam through his donkey. Some say God spoke to Balaam through his ass and has been speaking through asses ever since. So if God should choose to use us, then we should be grateful but not think too highly of ourselves. And if upon meeting someone we think God could never use, we should think again.

After all, Jesus says to the religious elite who looked down on everybody else: "The tax collectors and prostitutes are entering the Kingdom ahead

[TRL]

and for the record pot has not caused 1 single death ever, period. in compared to prescription drugs and alcohol and a s far as dirt weed being compared to the weed grown today. it's no different then using the right types of fertilizers to make a plant grow to it's potential. i'm sorry. but i have a hard time respecting anyone who says marijuana should be illegal. it should have the same regulations as cigarettes. you have to be 18 to buy it. and now. at least here in indiana. you can't smoke it within 8 feet of a public entrance. and you should also be able to grow it on your property.
in all honesty i would rather my kids sneak off and try pot than cigarettes and alcohol.

[philphan]

and for the record pot has not caused 1 single death ever, period. in compared to prescription drugs and alcohol and a s far as dirt weed being compared to the weed grown today. it's no different then using the right types of fertilizers to make a plant grow to it's potential. i'm sorry. but i have a hard time respecting anyone who says marijuana should be illegal. it should have the same regulations as cigarettes. you have to be 18 to buy it. and now. at least here in indiana. you can't smoke it within 8 feet of a public entrance. and you should also be able to grow it on your property.
in all honesty i would rather my kids sneak off and try pot than cigarettes and alcohol.

+1 Well said.

[Poop Cannon]

"as long as it doesn't harm anyone else"

uh, well ...you going od while you're a legal guardian towards someone kind of fits the description don't you think?

So what harm does the death of a child inflict in others? Are we talking physical or emotional harm? After all we are talking about making any drug legal for recreational purposes because we can all make smart decisions can't we? Oh wait......many drugs are illegal for a reason. Society as a whole sees the dangers and ill effects of illicit drugs and have decided to have them a banned substance.

How many good news stories do you get from smack? Anyone....anyone who argues for the free use of heroin is an idiot.

What the fuck are you blabbering about?

The guy posts "as long as it doesn't harm anyone else" and you post a witty response describing a scenario that is harming someone else.

[Brickbat]

and for the record pot has not caused 1 single death ever, period. in compared to prescription drugs and alcohol and a s far as dirt weed being compared to the weed grown today. it's no different then using the right types of fertilizers to make a plant grow to it's potential. i'm sorry. but i have a hard time respecting anyone who says marijuana should be illegal. it should have the same regulations as cigarettes. you have to be 18 to buy it. and now. at least here in indiana. you can't smoke it within 8 feet of a public entrance. and you should also be able to grow it on your property.
in all honesty i would rather my kids sneak off and try pot than cigarettes and alcohol.

THERE GOES MY HERO!

[Brickbat]

Allergic reactions to peanuts kill more people a year than marijuana. YES, marijuana is a plant, YES, marijuana is a drug (a mild one), YES, it is natural in the sense you can grow the shit in your own backyard w/o any additives, YES, its not that big of fucking deal, so why are we arguing about such a mute point? Let's just all go out and gorge on some fast food, come home drink some beer and smoke some Marlboro Reds like back in the day so we can all feel better about ourselves b/c we aren't hurting anyone. With all of the marijuana propaganda aside, does anybody really think its that harmful other than people who haven't tried it or politicians? ASK YOURSELF!

[Brickbat]

DID YOU ASK YOURSELF?

[FranklinsTower]

and for the record pot has not caused 1 single death ever, period. in compared to prescription drugs and alcohol and a s far as dirt weed being compared to the weed grown today. it's no different then using the right types of fertilizers to make a plant grow to it's potential. i'm sorry. but i have a hard time respecting anyone who says marijuana should be illegal. it should have the same regulations as cigarettes. you have to be 18 to buy it. and now. at least here in indiana. you can't smoke it within 8 feet of a public entrance. and you should also be able to grow it on your property.
in all honesty i would rather my kids sneak off and try pot than cigarettes and alcohol.

My good friend was really stoned one night driving with a few of his friends. anyway he lost control of the car and wrapped it around a tree. His closest friend died that night due to brain trauma. He says for sure it was the fact that he was high that caused the wreck and killed his friend.

Thats one.

I do support your right to get high responsibly-- but I do not trust most peoples capacity to be responsible with it.

He did not stop smoking pot after that until his conscience caught up with him. Then he had a spiritual awakening while practicing Christianities "centering prayer", and this caused him to quit drugs altogether. He now says that he can see how much marijuana was holding him back and he couldn't see it....

[philphan]

Why blame the pot, the guy sounds like a bad driver.

[Coffin]

i think knowledge of natural substances should be readily available and people left to their own judgement. people should be left to choose what and what not to do to their own bodies. we can kill ourselves slowly by divulging in fast food/alcohol/cigarettes. but it's against the law to partake in natural drugs.

What the fuck are you blabbering about?

The guy posts "as long as it doesn't harm anyone else" and you post a witty response describing a scenario that is harming someone else.

The concept of having illicit drugs readily available and and legal for the general public consumption because "what you choose to put in your body is no one elses business" is asinine, that is what fuck I am on about. Again, if you support the free use of heroin and similar drugs then you are an idiot.